Hobie Adventure with 20-foot Hobie sail

[RobertH]

I have a couple of questions for those of you who sail the Hobie Adventure with the 20-foot Hobie sail (like AlohaDan):

Up to what wind speed are you comfortable sailing on a beam reach without outriggers?

What wind speed would be the maximum without outriggers?

Does it make a difference whether you use the dagger board, i.e., does the dagger board add stability?

Please assume that the boat is loaded with a fair amount of gear, and let me know your weight too.

Thanks a lot!

Robert

[RobertH]

I have a couple of questions for those of you who sail the Hobie Adventure with the 20-foot Hobie sail (like AlohaDan):

Up to what wind speed are you comfortable sailing on a beam reach without outriggers?

What wind speed would be the maximum without outriggers?

Does it make a difference whether you use the dagger board, i.e., does the dagger board add stability?

Please assume that the boat is loaded with a fair amount of gear, and let me know your weight too.

Thanks a lot!

Robert

[Stobbo]

Hi Robert,

I see nobody has answered your questions yet so let me give you my $0.02...

All my comments relate to 'without outriggers'; I have an AI (upgraded from Adventure) and I have to say that I actually enjoy sailing the A/AI kayak more than I enjoy sailing the AI trimaran. Sure I go faster in the trimaran but the kayak sailing experience is more enjoyable in many ways I find. I have never considered the option of Hobie sidekicks.

I dunno what speeds I achieve. Suffice it to say that I can only use the sail in relatively light winds. It is not a speed yacht but it does slip along very nicely in the right conditions. I don't really know what windspeed I normally go out in but if the windsurfers are really belting along and jumping then definitely not (the water conditions would not be conducive in these windspeeds in any case), if they are stopping/starting to zipping a bit then probably, and if the cruising yachts look like they are struggling to get going then definitely. Basically a light breeze (~Beaufort 2-3 I guess) is best. If the wind picks up you can quickly end up 'on the edge' and if the wind dies progress will be slow. If you buy the sail with the intention of using it only in light winds you will not be disappointed. If you 'dip your toe' in light winds you will soon find out how far you can push the sailing limits of the boat & rig as the breeze increases... The sail and the amount of heel will let you know where the edge is: the sail deforms and the heel becomes alarming. Of course being so small these boats are much affected by wave action and as the wind picks up, so do the waves, which can quickly make sailing a tippy, uncomfortable affair and progress along a particular point of sail more difficult to maintain.

The daggerboard is essential IMHO - it adds stability and significantly increases upwind ability. Be aware that, unlike most sails designed for kayaks, the Hobie sail, being boomless, performs better upwind/across the wind than it does downwind because on a downwind course the sail tends to cycle through a fill then a collapse repeatedly which causes the kayak to wobble and lurch. I have considered poling the sail out with e.g. a bamboo pole for downwind sailing, but the other solution is to zigzag downwind on a very broad reach. While pointing ability with the daggerboard is pretty good and quite able to give good upwind progress, leeway is more than on a 'proper' sailing boat and particularly noticeable when waves are pushing you sideways (and this happens with even small waves on the sea) so you will not be able to maintain anything like the same upwind performance as a larger boat but you will still get upwind quite well - as long as you don't expect to be winning any tacking duels with 50' yachts.

In addition to the daggerboard you need the larger sailing rudder - the small one does not turn the boat quickly enough for sailing.

You also need to add some micro turning blocks through which you lead the sheet: one shackled to the rear padeye, the other shackled to one of the padeyes in the forward area of the cockpit to bring the sheet back to your hand. The blocks reduce friction on the sheet so that you can dump the sail like lightning in a gust (you will soon find out that it is very comforting to be able to do this and it increases your chances of staying dry). The turning block in the cockpit is there so that you can pull on the rope to pull the sail in, rather than push the rope to pull the sail in. You should loop the rudder retaining bungee over the rear carry handle before you set out to prevent the sheet from catching up in the carry handle and re-introducing friction into the sheet arrangement... if you want to stay dry, that is.

I also installed a small clamcleat (brand) cleat in the RH tray under the net cover so that I could cleat the sheet off in gentle conditions and sail hands-free. I would slip the elastic of the net down under the cleat to expose the cleat and then pull the rope into it - releasing it was just a case of a quick tug - and it was often much preferable to handcramps from holding onto the sheet.

I weigh ~210lbs. I haven't really sail loaded up with much gear other than fishing gear. Tie down every bit of gear you have on deck that you don't want to lose !

I really, really enjoy sailing my kayak instead of pedalling it and would recommend anyone to give it a go. I find it every bit as enjoyable as sailing much bigger boats because it is so engaging and because you have a very much more intimate (and only once did it become slightly too intimate) acquaintance with the water. But then I sail in Auckland, NZ where the conditions are regularly ideal and the water never gets ice cold.

Hope this helps.

Enjoy !

[AlohaDan]

I don't sail without Sidekick.

Too many chances to huli. Wind, big fish, etc. when I'm off shore I have no desire to huli, although have done so (see below)

Like Stobbo I use the big rudder and also installed a cam cleat for the main sheet.

The dagger board is essential for up wind tack, but like AI guys, I'll pull it running downwind. My results in heavy swells may be diferent than Roadrunners on his lake. we probably have equal chop though for the same wind.

I'll run in higher winds than Hobie recommends. Broke the ama off on the plastic insert doing this one time when caught in wind shear line. Beaufort 5-6. Went over quickly before I could release clew or mainsheet.

Probably should have hand furled sail. Looking fwd to AI furling device.

Nicest thing about the small sail is it's boosting power. Yor can easily get the Adventure up to 4-5 knots with light pedalling when the sail has some decent wind.

It's also relatively easy to dismount, furl, and stow when fighting a large fish. Under 30 seconds.

The small sail is pretty sensitive to light stuff, but your not going to get more than 1-2 knots in light breezes without pedal assist.

I weigh 192-196 depending on the beer supply. I assume Stobbo has an unlimited amount http://kfs.infopop.cc/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif therefore I'll be visting Auckland in February.

[Stobbo]

Not an unlimted supply regrettably but look me up when you get here & I will happily share mine... http://www.kayakfishingstuff.com/images/maps/thumbsup.gif

[omega]

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/7541/21sail31ub7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img503.imageshack.us/img503/6038/sailnr7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/8320/sail4gs2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://kfs.infopop.cc/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

[RobertH]

Thanks, everyone, that gives me a pretty good idea of what to expect. http://www.kayakfishingstuff.com/images/maps/thumbsup.gif

[JonS]

The problem isn't how fast you can go, but the gusts. When sailing without the outriggers I found I was on edge all the time. If I didn't release the sail fast enough I'd be in the water. It never happened but I sure came close too many times. Use sidekicks.

[Scott]

A dagger board helps to convert lateral pressure into forward pressure. As there is very little weight involved in the dagger, I believe there is minimal effect on stability, some, but not like a keel or a weighted dagger board. On a down wind run, consider holding the main sheet out to the side with a paddle or even an arm. Down wind is one of the more difficult sailing positions. when beating, up wind, consider sailing less aggressively to the wind, come off just a bit and the boat will handle better. If you set the sail and then sail the setting and not the direction you'll feel the boat settle into a groove, difficult to explain, it's a seat of the pants feeling. You kind of feel the boat on a flat table and when it falls into the groove, the boat will heal and accelerate. Pinching the wind, or angled to close to the wind makes for some hairy sailing especially if relatively new to sailing. The problem with sailing a kayak is that your body is the counter balance and you are fairly limited in how far you can hike out to counter balance the force of the sail. not enough and over you go. Ease the sail and she'll pop up like a cork.

Man I miss sailing.....

[RDLB]

I'm new to this forum. Has anyone actually tried fishing from an Adventure Island Trimaran? I was also wondering if anyone has installed some net trampolines on the trimaran.

Seems like fishing would be a pain, but the versatility of the platform to handle changing weather, sail with reasonable performance, use for diving, I wonder if it might be worth it. Any experiences with this or directions to relevant posts would be awesome as I am seriously considering this kayak if the trimaran is a viable option.

Striper season is knocking on the door...

[RDLB]

Ahhhh I should have done some looking before I posted. Tons of stuff about rigging it, but not to many accounts of fishing experience. Any stories about how awesome it was to fish from, pr how lame?